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Episode 7
is the seventh episode of the first season and the 7th overall episode of Mindhunter. Short Summary Wendy takes a career risk to relocate and join the team full time. Holden and Bill find it harder to keep the emotional intensity of work at bay. Full Summary Park City, Kansas The ADT serviceman has a jacket, tape, and gloves laid out on his bed. He checks his gun and then puts it on top. Salem, Oregon Bill and Holden drive into a prison as the audio plays of a man laughing and bragging. They surrender their weapons and badges and sign the waivers. Jerry Brudos is led out of his cell to them as he continues to brag. He is finally handcuffed to a table near them. Holden introduces himself and Bill. Jerry asks for cigarettes and pizza. Bill says he can't do that, but can get him anything in the commissary. He gets angry, but then reveals he's just messing with them. Jerry agrees to let them record, saying he'll do the interview as long as he knows he doesn't have to. Holden and Bill continue to sit at the adjacent table as they start the interview. They ask him about the lead-up to killing his first victim. He says he didn't kill her. They never found her body and was never convicted of it. He also says he never confessed to it. When Holden reads out his confessions, Brudos says to ignore that and it was coerced. He says the Portland PD set him up and forced him to confess. He met the woman, but didn't kill her. Holden starts to ask about the day before he met the woman, but Bill asks him about his attraction to women's fashions. They show him a photo of one of his victims and he pauses for a moment before saying he doesn't remember taking it. Bill brings it closer to him and shows him that his face is in the photo, meaning he took it, which also means he killed her. Brudos says Kemper was right when he said they were idiots. He laughs at them for believing Kemper. Bill thought all Kemper's communication was monitored, but Brudos says word gets around in prison. As they leave, Holden and Bill discuss their subjects communicating with each other. They know it'll affect their outcomes. Holden is worried that Kemper called them idiots. He says it doesn't sound right to him. As they board their plane, Holden suggests going to see Kemper and asking him. The man who has the middle seat in their row interrupts. Bill offers him the aisle seat so he and Holden can talk, but he insists on sitting in his assigned seat. On the flight, Bill and Holden talk over the businessman between them, passing photos from Brudos as they talk about how Brudos became who he is. As they pass a photo with a severed foot, the businessman offers to switch Bill, but Bill says he's enjoying the extra leg room of the aisle seat. Wendy listens to the Brudos recording. She finds it fascinating. She wonders if he's lying or denying when he claims not to remember. Bill thinks he's lying. Wendy says they can learn from what he doesn't tell them, because they're not always going to get guys like Kemper who want to talk. Bill and Holden say they asked around and there's no evidence he and Kemper were ever actually in touch. Holden says if they are somehow anyway, it could screw up their research, but Wendy doesn't think so. She asks what they'd talk about, if they'd shared details of what they'd done. They're on opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to what they'd admit. They have a new category to sort by: post-conviction admission or non-admission of guilt. Bill says they didn't get anything useful out of Brudos, but Wendy thinks that they actually did. Bill thinks it's only useful to her study, not their work, but she disagrees. She then excuses herself to get coffee. Bill and Holden follow her as she explains that the way he lies is interesting, because his lies are so far-fetched no one would believe him. He lied, they showed him the evidence, and then he ended the interview. Wendy suggests not backing him into a corner. She's certain he has more information to add to their data. In one of his cases, he pretended to be his own twin brother and talked about himself in the third person. Wendy says pretending to be someone else gives him room. She says he's not averse to talking about his family, because he mentioned his kids. She suggests that Bill talk about his son to get him talking, but Bill refuses. She says he doesn't have to talk about his family. He can make one up. He just needs to build rapport. She tells them to indulge him. After she walks away, Holden asks when Bill wants to go back. He doesn't, but Holden suggest next week and Bill agrees. Holden listens in on a call Bill has with Jerry's ex-wife. When she finds she's not legally required to talk to him, she hangs up on him. However, Bill notices she referred to him as "Jer." Debbie and Holden are shopping. He didn't buy some shirts because he doesn't like patterns and Debbie points out that he dresses the same off-duty as on. Debbie spots a shoe store and looks inside. Holden paces nearby as Debbie gets told she measured at a 7.5, a half-size larger than normal. Holden doesn't think it's a big deal, but she doesn't want big feet. She offers a shoe out to Holden to try on which he does reluctantly. She likes them, but he doesn't. Holden asks the clerk what the largest size he has of one of the heeled shoes is. The clerk doesn't know, but Holden has him put a pair on hold. Again, Brudos laughs as he's led to talk to them. Holden has the guard not cuff him to the table. Holden also offers him a cigarette. Holden asks where he got a scar and he says his wife found out he was chasing skirt and came after him with a knife. Holden says they'd appreciate honestly. Holden tells him what they know he's been jumped in prison. They tell him they want details and want to know why he did what he did. His ex-wife testified that he approached her dressed as a woman. Brudos says his ex-wife said what the police wanted her to say. Brudos asks for Bill's wife's name and when Bill refuses, he says he appreciates honesty. Bill says her name is Nancy. Brudos asks how she deals with things she doesn't understand. His own wife wasn't adventurous at all. They were young when they married. By that point, he'd already started stealing women's clothes and photographed a neighborhood girl. They ask him next about the shoes. He had a collection of women's shoes in his garage. He tries to claim they were his wife's, but they were much too large. He then says that friends sent them to him, as Holden moves his jacket to reveal the pair of shoes he bought on the table in their box. He says the shoe sending started as a goof then got out of hand. He asks about the shoes and Holden says they're a reward for honesty. Brudos then says he's a collector. He doesn't have to wear the shoes to get off. When he asks why they're so interested in the shoes, Bill says he's asking because Brudos' wife still doesn't understand it. Brudos says she wouldn't talk about him. She had to divorce him to protect their kids. Bill points out that she also changed her last name. Bill starts to goad Brudos and asks him why the shoes. Brudos tells Bill to give Darcie his love and Bill says he'll do that, calling him "Jer." Brudos then gets up to end the interview. Bill admits that Darcie really hung up on them and Holden holds the shoebox and tells him he's forgetting something. Brudos comes back over and takes the shoes. Brudos says they should have brought him a pair of Nancy's, which angers Bill. Brudos sits down and holds one of the shoes. Holden asks him when the interest in women's shoes started and he says it was always there. At some point, it became sexual. He says he got his first pair when he was five. He found them in the junkyard and brought them home. He'd never seen anything like that before, except in pictures. His mother never wore heels. When asked what his mother thought of him having them, he just shrugs. Holden tells the story of his mother once walking on him masturbating. She was shocked and thought he needed psychological help. Brudos says his mother burned the shoes, right in front of him. His mother always wanted a girl. She had his brother then she wanted a girl next and told him so all the time. He wore the shoes around the house. Holden asks if he was trying to be what she wanted him to be. Brudos says he never wanted to be a girl. He just liked the shoes. He took a pair of his teacher's shoes once in first grade. She wasn't angry, just curious why he'd taken them. Since he was married, he installed a security system so his wife never came to the garage and found him. Brudos takes the shoes to another table and starts to masturbate. Bill calls the guard. Holden and Bill talk about the interview as they walk out. Bill asks if the story Holden told was true and he says it was. Bill's surprised it didn't bother him to tell it. It bothered Bill. Bill says if what they do doesn't get under Holden's skin, he's either more screwed up than Bill thought or he's kidding himself. Wendy is eating a can of tuna and watching All in the Family. She takes her plate to the kitchen and then takes her laundry basket and goes to the basement. She puts in the laundry and soap and as she starts the load, she hears a cat meowing. She looks for it and calls for it, but it doesn't come out. She goes back to her apartment, grabs the can of tuna, and brings it back to the basement for the cat. She then sits up on the washer and waits for a minute before going back upstairs. Wendy goes to the basement and finds the can of tuna empty. She throws away the empty can. Holden doodles a dead woman next to a pair of heels. He watches Bill talk to his wife. He then talks to Wendy, who has finished listening to the Brudos tape. Holden thinks the tape is great. Bill joins them and Wendy asks what's in the box. She guesses shoes. Bill says he got an erection, which Wendy believes is what they wanted. They say they wanted to get him talking. She says they baited him with he shoes and lied to him about his wife. Bill says he lied about Kemper, so they did the same thing to him. Bill views it as speaking Brudos' language. She's upset by it, but Bill says it's how men talk. She's upset that they didn't use the questionnaire, but Bill says it wasn't working. Wendy says they just wanted to force him to admit that he wears women's clothes. They say they want to use it to learn to recognize the behavior in others. She tells them that cross-dressing isn't an antecedent to homicidal behavior. For most, it's a harmless form of expression. It's only sometimes sexual. It's been practiced in every era, in every culture. She says they weren't speaking his language. They were persecuting him about something that challenges their masculinity. The interview was personal. Bill gets defensive and says they can't get to Brudos the way she wants them to. Bill and Nancy are having dinner and talking about a music therapist for Brian. She says she can drive him there once a week. It's $45 for an hour and a half. He says it's a lot of money. He also got a recommendation for a child psychologist much closer to them. She asks when he got the recommendation. He says a month ago. He didn't tell her because he didn't really want to send Brian to a shrink, but he'd rather send him to a doctor than a hippie musician. He was hoping they wouldn't reach that point. Bill and Nancy leave to go home. On the ride home, Nancy says Brian's going to get kicked out of school if he keeps biting other children. Bill says he's defending himself from bullies. They should have held him back a year. Nancy doesn't think that's the problem. She's ready some books that recommend music therapy when children need help with communication. Bill doesn't want to talk about it anymore. Nancy and Bill get home to find Julie who is disturbed. She says Brian is asleep, but she found a photo under his bed. it's a crime scene photo of the woman who was sodomized with a broomstick. Bill apologizes for her having to see that. Julie says Brian saw it too. They say they'll talk to him. Julie says she's applying for a job at the mall and won't be able to sit for them anymore. She tells them to say goodbye to Brian for her. After she's gone, Bill says he needs to find the key to the filing cabinet or just get a new one. Nancy asks why the photos in the house at all. He says he has to bring work home sometimes. She asks what he does with photos like that and he says he examines them for clues. They argue over how it happened and why it happened. Nancy is upset because Bill's not around much. Bill says Brian's not very fun. He can't get Brian to interact with him. Bill goes and searches for photos in his office to show her the disturbing cases he works on. As he starts to break down, she holds him and he says he's sorry. Then he looks closer at a photo. Wendy opens a new can of tuna and takes it downstairs with a glass of wine. She puts out the tuna and waits nearby, drinking her wine. She steps farther away when the cat doesn't come. Then she gives up and goes back upstairs. As she reaches the top of the stairs, she hears the cat meowing and the can rattling. Wendy is hanging up art in her office when Holden brings her a cup of coffee. He tells her something happened with Brudos between the mom and the shoes. He asks her what it was. She says it was the force of her reaction. Burning the shoes seared them in his mind as forbidden. Then the teacher reacted differently, so he got mixed messages about his impulses. Wendy says not everyone agrees with Freud's theories, but he did hit on how young they were when they start to form preferences. Holden asks when that came in and how it got tied to his sexuality. Could someone have intervened. She says he's asking the right questions. He wants the right answers. He's glad to have Wendy there. Holden tells Bill he has an idea about another angle to take with Brudos. Bill asks him to save it and he makes a call to talk to Frank McGraw. He leaves a message for Frank to look at the photos from the Ada Jeffries case, specifically at the knots used to tie her up. They're nautical and Fairfield is landlocked. Holden's surprised that Bill is back on that case, but Bill says they agreed to take a look. Holden asks if he's sure there's still something, but Bill interrupts and tells Holden to leave him alone. As Holden goes back to transcribing tapes, Wendy comes in and talks to Bill about remaining objective in interviews. She knows it's very hard. The people they're talking about are damaged and know how to cause damage. He says he's running on fumes, so she suggests he take a break or talk to someone. He says he's talking to her and she is a professional. She says she can't be his therapist because she's his co-worker. He says it's not like that. She tells him times have changed and he doesn't just have to be the good soldier. Bill looks over at Holden and says he's immune and wants to know how to tap into that. Debbie is getting dinner on the table when Holden rings the bell. She lets him in and tells him she made dinner. After they finish eating, Holden says she's been holding out on him. He asks her to marry him, but she says she doesn't want to marry him so she can cook for him. They toast to her skills and her changing his life. He wants her to know that he sees how dedicated and disciplined she is. He says he's delighted to be in her life. She gets up from the table and beckons him to follow her. They start kissing when she leaves him for a moment. He takes off his shoes and his shirt. She comes back in in only lingerie and heels. When he feels the heels, he's immediately put off, remembering Brudos. He tries to continue, but can't stop thinking about Brudos and looking at the shoes. Debbie notices he's not aroused and asks if he's okay. He says this, it's not her. She says that's the point and leaves. Cast 1x07HoldenFord.png|Holden Ford 1x07BillTench.png|Bill Tench 1x07DebbieMitford.png|Debbie Mitford 1x07WendyCarr.png|Wendy Carr 1x07NancyTench.png|Nancy Tench 1x07JerryBrudos.png|Jerry Brudos 1x07Tony.png|Tony 1x07Julie.png|Julie 1x07ShoeStoreClerk.png|Shoe Store Clerk 1x07DennisRader.png|ADT Serviceman Dennis Rader 1x07Businessman.png|Businessman Main Cast *Jonathan Groff as Holden Ford *Holt McCallany as Bill Tench *Hannah Gross as Debbie Mitford *Anna Torv as Wendy Carr Also Starring *Stacey Roca as Nancy Tench *Happy Anderson as Jerry Brudos *Kenneth Israel as Tony *Jordyn DiNatale as Julie *Adam Kroloff as Shoe Store Clerk Other Cast *Sonny Valicenti as ADT Serviceman *Ashley Smith as Businessman Cases Music Notes and Trivia * Gallery Episode Stills 1x07-1.JPG 1x07-2.jpg 1x07-3.JPG 1x07-4.JPG Quotes See Also es:Capítulo 7 Category:Episodes Category:S1 Episodes